An Internet Meeting with Mikhail Borisovich Piotrovsky in the Hermitage's CafeMax
On 8 December 2003

Some people say that many of the paintings hanging in the galleries are not originals. They think that for security reasons you are storing the originals of certain paintings in a special warehouse. Are there any grounds for this opinion?
There are better and less well founded opinions. This one is the sort that people hold when they do not go to museums. Everything in the Hermitage is always genuine. We don't store anything in special warehouses. If there are any copies, they date from the 16th or 17th centuries.

Mikhail Borisovich, what is the reason for making electronic copies of the works of art held in your museum? Is this because some items simply cannot be shown at all and that it is even a complicated matter to preserve them?
All of the art works can be displayed, but this is rather complex. We do not make electronic copies. Rather what we make is digital images. This is a technical solution, a supplement and also a tool for then making reproductions.

Are the buildings of the Hermitage used for other purposes such as, for example, presentations, conferences, festivities for children?
In the Hermitage we prohibit the use of the word "presentation", since this usually means some kind of private event and they are not allowed. However, we do organize festivities for children; we have a theater; we find place for carnival processions. When we open exhibitions we offer receptions for the vernissage. The Hermitage is the host for these events; no private individual can rent a hall to celebrate his birthday. For holidays we invite our friends in: the Club of Friends of the Hermitage.

Can you describe the make-up of visitor groups to the Hermitage? Would you like to change the composition of visitors in any way?
The most diverse types of people visit the Hermitage. Firstly, we have the tourists. Secondly, there are the regular visitors. Each year around 2.5 million people visit the Hermitage, and of them 600,000 - 700,000 do so free of charge. Between 400,000 and one million are foreigners. We are constantly trying to bring in new visitor contingents.

Which halls of the Hermitage are most popular with visitors?
That depends on which visitors you mean. However strange it may seem, foreigners are not interested in those things we have come to love from childhood. Let us take, for example, the Knights' Room: it is of no interest to tourists. The Coat of Arms Hall and the War Gallery of 1812 are interesting for us, but not especially so for tourists. The tourist is looking for well known names: the Impressionists, Rembrandt. Visitors coming on their own go to rooms where there is a lot of information posted.

Dear Mr Piotrovsky, please tell us whether the Government has been more favorably disposed to your museum over the last three years than it was formerly? Has this improved your financial wellbeing and added to the Museum's budget?
The Government's attitude towards us is favorable and at the same time it is not a simple one. Either people love the Hermitage or they don't. The Hermitage is an indicator of the health of Russia. Each year our financial situation is improving, but the financial contribution from the state is declining. The Hermitage can generate money on its own. Relations with the government may be better, but we are always walking on a tightrope. The authorities want us to function well, but at the same time they wish to control us.

What is the average level of pay of rank and file staff of the Museum? Are they civil servants on fixed salary schedules or can the Museum pay them supplemental compensation from its own budget? What commercial activity does the Museum engage in aside from sale of entrance tickets?
The salary level is not high. Though staff are indeed civil servants, salaries are 2-3 times higher than the formal bureaucratic schedules. The base salary may be defined by the state, but the Hermitage has its revenues from outside the state and these resources partly go to raise the compensation to employees. Nonetheless pay here is 100 to 200 times less than abroad and it is not right that there is such a gulf in compensation.

The internet cafe in the museum is just super. In the West such things as a fully equipped internet cafe exist in museums, libraries and bookstores. They often provide completely free access to the internet. In Russia, however, this idea is very rarely implemented. Please tell us the details. How did you get the idea of creating an internet cafe in the Museum and whom does it belong to?
Some smart people whom we have known well for many years came to us and said, "Well, here is our plan." We thought it over and set it up together. As far as I know, this is the first project of its kind in St Petersburg. As for the cost of services, we pay in Russia much less for most everything, including internet access.

Does the Hermitage plan to take its collections on tour to any cities?
The Hermitage has a very big program of exhibitions. We try to make our collections more accessible to the public. Now we are implementing a program of exhibitions in 6-8 cities in Siberia. We also have exhibitions underway in Novgorod. And we take with us only very good works of art.

It is no secret that for many people outside this city 'St Petersburg' has architectural and cultural associations with the words 'Nevsky' and 'Hermitage'. Is it difficult to run an institution which is one of the main symbols of the city? Does this impose an additional responsibility on you and does it demand additional attention to your image? After all it seems as if you are the equivalent of 'cultural mayor' of Petersburg.
The Hermitage is a big symbol. And all of us, myself included, always have to keep this in mind. We all lend support to the image of the Hermitage. It is not the Hermitage that belongs to us; rather we belong to the Hermitage. There are two symbols in St Petersburg: the Mariinsky Theater and the Hermitage. The Mariinsky Theater means people. A theater after all is nothing without people. The Hermitage is a symbol that begins with the way our staff appear and goes all the way to the general look of the museum. All these different things define the 'face' of the Hermitage. We belong to the Hermitage; we preserve it, come what may.

Can you give us an idea of visitor levels on the Hermitage website? Can this be compared in some way to the average daily number of 'real' or 'live' visitors who come in to see the museum?
They are comparable. We have 2.5 million visitors a year to the museum, 1 million visitors to our exhibitions abroad, and 1.5 million visitors to the website. The site is an important part of artistic life and it is constantly being developed further.

How do you feel about the idea of 'virtual' museums in the internet? Does your museum deal with this issue?
Part of our website is a virtual museum, and the idea is important in itself. A museum should not be just a toy or a distraction. It's fine if you can leave the Hermitage and find yourself in the Louvre, if you are given the chance to admire the architecture of the whole world in movement...

Why did you agree to take part in this internet meeting? Is it because today's young people find it easier to slip into the internet and spend a half hour looking at exhibition items that interest them rather than to wait for their parents to give them money for trip into Petersburg?
I agreed because I always agree to something interesting. It's a good thing that people can get to know the Hermitage without having to come here. There is another side to the matter - making some inquiry. You can learn a lot on the internet.

Describe for us, please, the museum of the 21st century. What should it be like?
It will be a hi-tech museum. But that should not push into the background the main thing: the atmosphere of bygone centuries. A museum should be a place of amusement, a place where we experience pleasure while preserving the spirit of a museum.

The Hermitage is our 'do not touch' sign. Wouldn't you agree? Isn't the Hermitage an empire with a certain imperial nostalgia? Don't you see yourself as an heir to empire? To the external world you are very likable, intelligent and smooth, in the good sense. But are you really like that? And if I may return to the question of empire: people are trumpeting the 'Greater Hermitage' the same way they toot their horn at the Mariinsky, but just what is this? Is it imperial? Is it the ageless museum? Or is it a version of 'I erected a monument...'? Please try to tell the truth.
What kind of person am I? I cannot say very precisely but I hope that I am what I appear to be. I do not consider mуself to be imperial. We are all small people who have a great deal to do to energize others. The Hermitage is very 'touchable'. Our every move is transparent and is touched by others. This keeps us fit.

Which works on display do you personally like?
I like the exhibition areas that we have just completed. I like the Hall of Archaic and Classical Greek Art, the War Gallery of 1812, the Halls of Venetian Painting. They are all newly restored. The latest baby is always the best loved.

Does the Hermitage plan to offer courses for young people over the internet? Have you developed any interactive teaching programs?
This year we and IBM opened the Hermitage Virtual Academy with such new programs as the Times of Knights, Ancient Egypt, the Winter Palace. The term 'distance learning' may not be very pretty but it is very important.

Don't you think it is time to open a museum of contemporary art on scale no smaller than the Hermitage? After all young artists also need to develop their talents, wouldn't you say?
Yes...young artists need to develop but without thinking of this museum. We have a splendid place called the Russian Museum which puts on shows of new art, including foreign art. We must have a museum of contemporary art. We in the Hermitage will show 20th century art, but only art which already has become history, so to speak.

Are you planning to add to the Hermitage collection in the near future?
We have such plans. Of course, the money is not there, but we are trying to find it. In the theater we are now exhibiting the remarkable wall tapestry called "Horse and Elephant", a 15th century carpet that is Turkish-Caucasian. On 9 December the Museum of the Russian Guards will open in the General Staff building complex. It is still possible we will reach agreement for the long term display of other collections as well, including private collections. This is a good tradition.

How did the celebration of the anniversary of the founding of St Petersburg affect your museum? Were you involved in building any 'Potemkin villages'? Did the anniversary celebrations help your museum in any way?
The anniversary celebrations helped us. We completed many projects. We completed the construction of an open storage center for art works which is the most technically advanced in Europe. We opened a new entrance to the Hermitage from the side of the Palace Square thereby changing the topography of both the Hermitage and the city. As for sham, or 'Potemkin villages' - well, there weren't any. That is an historically proven fact. Potemkin showed Catherine how things would be eventually. There is nothing wrong in the fact that we renovated the facades in time for the anniversary. Moscow is one of the cleanest and best cared for cities, and they also began by working on the facades. If the facade looks good, then people will be more attentive to the cleanliness of the building stairwells and beyond.

From what age do you recommend parents bring their children to the Hermitage? I mean from what age will it be interesting for the children? And do you have any special exhibitions for children?
As soon as they can walk, and maybe even earlier. Many tourists bring children in backpacks. That's fine. Let them absorb the beauty. A small toddler will walk and look at the floors. When he grows, he will study the ceilings. The earlier, the better. Later there will be the Hermitage groups, lectures, other programs. For Christmas we always organize an exhibition of works by children. We have an accessible and interesting electronic collection.

Do you have plans for providing distance learning courses together with any institutions of higher learning? For example, some students take specialized courses that would be easier to study by visiting the Hermitage but they have no such possibility. If there were a virtual academy where the students might receive their assignments, consult with Hermitage staff, and send in their papers for evaluation by Hermitage specialists...That would be interesting for the students!
It is also interesting for the Hermitage staff. We have already created a Hermitage Academy, though we do not work together with any specific institutions of higher learning. The Hermitage Academy is open to all. The future beckons.

Mikhail Borisovich, please tell us which collections have been chosen as the first to make electronic copies and why? Or is it done not by dividing up the collections but by taking the most important single display items?
There are two ways we use to add to our electronic library. The first is quite serious. We choose the most important works of art. The second is purely practical: we are making slides especially for exhibitions. Ideally all of our works of art will enter our digital library and be available on the internet.

What is the approximate percent of young people among the general numbers of visitors to the Hermitage?
Young people do go to the Hermitage. You can find everything under the sun here, beginning with jazz concerts and on to the classics. The Hermitage gives you a chance to walk and think without any didactics. Nobody teaches you anything here against your will. Art museums are fashionable everywhere in the world.

Do you organize school visits for schoolchildren from other cities?
We organize visits for schoolchildren from all over. You need only make contact with the office of guided tours.

Are there any near term plans for joint projects in our country with well known museums from around the world such as the Louvre, for example? Do you have near term plans for exhibitions in Moscow on your own or together with partners?
We have special relations with the Kunsthistorisches Museum in Vienna and with the Guggenheim Museum among others. We also do arrange exhibitions in Moscow. It is interesting to work with the Moscow museums but not so necessary since it is simpler for Muscovites to travel to the Hermitage and see it for themselves.

Mikhail Borisovich, please tell us about the 'digital collection'. How will we be able to see such collections? How much will it cost to see them? And will it be possible to take a guided tour and ask questions?
It costs nothing to visit the digital collection. There is no tour guide.. and very likely there will be none. Every item shown has an annotation and links, so that the information given is sufficient. There you can learn on your own, you can play... It is most interesting...

What charitable activities is the Hermitage planning?
We do not have any special charitable programs but we do a great deal free of charge. We ourselves are in need of charitable support. You have to remember that every free service provided by the Hermitage is a service paid for by the museum itself. Since 1 January we have introduced one day a month, tentatively the first Thursday, when visitors coming on their own are admitted for free. Russian retirees and also all full time students regardless of their country of residence are granted free entrance. There is a special entrance price for citizens of the Russian Federation and it is not much. Actually the price is indecently low. It is lower than in the Russian Museum or in the suburban museums. I never once heard anyone thank us for the fact that for so long we kept the price very low, at 15 rubles, whereas I receive many letters expressing the opinion that for a museum like ours this price is indecently low. All of this means that a change in the price will be justified.

I would like to know whether you have plans to organize branches of the Hermitage in different cities (not only large, but also small cities) in the near future?
It takes a supreme effort of preparation and security, etc. to create a branch of the Hermitage. A branch is an exhibition complex, a permanent representation of the museum. In February we are opening just such a center in Amsterdam. There will be a center in Kazan, but none in small cities. However, a separate collection on display can become part of the Hermitage. One example is the collection of the Lomonosov Porcelain Factory. We have a representation in Somerset House, London and in Los Vegas.

Does the Hermitage have any art works produced in the 21st century? Which ones?
Up to now, no. It seems that even in the internet cafe everything was made back in the 20th century.

Thank you very much. It was very interesting to speak with you. People always comment that there is no chat room on the Hermitage site. There is a forum. Now, possibly, we will add chat. Goodbye!